Gideon Bible Distribution Halted
Fortunately, when challenged these practices are usually halted - for example the handing out of Bibles by the Gideons in Missouri, as the First Amendment Center reports:
"From this day forward, the Gideons will not be allowed to come into the school during the school day to speak with kids about their group," Principal Kenny Youmans wrote. "The Gideons also are going to be prohibited from handing out religious materials to kids during the school day." ... The parent who complained did not want his name revealed. He said his child returned home from school on Sept. 23 with a New Testament from the Gideons. The father was upset because he believed it violated the separation of church and state.
Of course, the support comes from evangelical Christians who don't see anything wrong with the government working to promote Christianity to other people's children. If atheists were to distribute atheist literature, if Muslims were to distribute the Qur'an, and if Hare Krishnas were to distribute their own writings, then you know that the same Christians would raise a furious outcry about what was going on. It's a double-standard, obviously, but not one that should exist. The government should be neutral with regards to all religious or theistic perspectives, not favoring or disfavoring any of them. Christians who think that their religion should receive special, favorable treatment are simply trying to promote the early stages of a theocracy - there's really no other word for it.
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The bible has had more impact on the history of humanity than any other book. It’s outrageous that any child is allowed to leave school _without_ having read it! Have you actually read it? What are you so frightened about?
Wake up! Almost every book in the classroom is atheistic!
Of course other religious literature should also be allowed. How can children get a rounded education with the sort of censorship you’re advocating?
I agree. I think that a rigorous, scholarly, and academic introduction to the Bible should be part of everyone’s education. Unfortunately, such an introduction would conflict with the literalist teachings common in so many churches, so it’s unlikely that Christians would allow it.
You see, it’s not atheists who object to objective, academic courses about the Bible — it’s Christians who do.
Several times, several translations.
I’m not frightened of anything, but I do object to outside religious groups being given the special privilege of entering schools and promoting their preferred Bible translation.
Literature that promotes particular religious viewpoints over others? I disagree. What religions would you have privileged and why?
What sort of censorship am I advocating?
I am outraged at the prohibition of the Gideon’s distributing the Bible.
This country was FOUNDED on CHRISTIAN religious freedom. I am tired of these school children and their outspoken parents - 1 of the entire population of the United States, telling this country what to do!
We have enjoyed freedoms in the US that no one else in the world has and I believe that if God is taken out of this society we will suffer the consequences.
If you don’t want to worship the one TRUE God, that is your choice. You are living in the US, a Christian based society. If you don’t like it, you can leave!
Would you be outraged if Muslims were prevented from distributing the Quran in public schools?
What about religious freedom for non-Christians?
How is “Christian religious freedom” being infringed upon when a Christian organization is not given special privileges by the state?
Parents shouldn’t speak out on behalf of the equality of their children?
Why?
What is “Christian” about the government or laws?
Why not instead just fight for equality for everyone and against special privileges for any one group? Or would that be unAmerican?
Carmen, if you don’t like the drapes, you don’t MOVE OUT of your home. You change the drapes!
America was based on religious/spiritual freedom for ALL.
George Washington said: “The government of the United States is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion”
Many of our founding fathers were not Xian. And some of them owned slaves… so let’s be careful when we speak of their intentions.
I support Gideon Bibles and the Book of Mormon because it is free speech on private property. I wish “Why I Am Not a Christian” by Bertrand Russell would get just as much circulation.
I just throw the Gideon Bible out–Gideon was a terrible man by all accounts. Besides, the Bible should be locked up in libraries so that people under 18 years of age do not see this filth. Daughters sleeping with their father, David causing his girlfriend’s husband to be killed, thousands of people killed by Moses in “the ban”, and so on.
I used to teach comparative religions as part of a world history course, and I was repeatedly stunned at how little of religious tradition my high school students had learned.
And these were students who regularly claimed they failed to turn in their homework because they had midweek bible study after school for several hours, on more than one day, plus Sunday School AND Saturday Church activities.
In all that, they never heard about the Nicene Creed, the religious ferment of the Eastern Mediterranean around the historical origins of Christianity, or even the most basic descriptions of other religious beliefs.
So, sure, read the Bible, but in a comparative religions context, and give students a chance to understand what, away from school, they may learn only to recite meaninglessly.
I’d be willing to bet that no one but a few jesus freaks even read the bible that’s left in hotels and motels. If people are so interested in reading the bible all the time, they should carry a copy with them every where they go.
Bibles should be limited to churches and
the homes of people who care about that
book.
Personally I would like a copy of Hitchen’s book, “God Is Not Great, etc.”
left in my hotel room. At least it would contain intelligent information.
think we all know who was responsible for that, the Godless liberals who cannot stand having their immorality shoved back in their ugly face!! The defenders of free thought, the Big Bang theory and evolution, are not only striking out at me, but at all Christians. . Last night, while I was sitting on my front-porch swing, gazing up at Heaven, President Bush appeared to me in a vision. He told me that my work was not yet finished, there were still many liberals who had not yet seen the glory of the coming of the Lord!! President Bush would not be in the White House right now if God didn’t want him there. President Bush was put in a position of leadership in order to wipe the devil’s religion of Islam off the face of the Earth, so that the Christian God can fill the world with His message of peace and love. President Bush has stated numerous times that he speakes with God in the Oval Office, he even asked God for military advice before the invasion of Iraq. Modern liberalism is the equivalent of atheism, liberals are in favor of killing babies, raising taxes, teaching evolution, and same sex marriage. Jesus is opposed to all of these horrible things.
I admire the courage of the father who took issue with this. Of course there would have been more of an uproar if The Koran or “atheistic” literature had been distributed. But I really think in this day and age our children would really benefit from a comparative religion course at the elementary or high school level.
“God” is a manmade idea: nothing more. Deal with it.
I’m in high school and I personally wouldn’t want other people’s religions shoved onto me. I choose to be atheist even after I attended church for a number of years and just having to walk by lockers with bible verses on them is enough of an intrusion on my beliefs. I feel that if someone wants to be atheist, muslim, christian, or any other religion they should be left to believe in what they want and not what other people tell them to. I’d like to think that just because I choose to be atheist doesn’t mean that close-minded people wouldn’t feel that I should leave America, where one of our rights is the freedom of religion, not the freedom of only being Christian.
I am so sorry people feel this way about the Gideons. For you Atheist, I feel more than sorrow for you. When you find out there is a God it will be to late for you. Our children from pre-school through high school should know about God, then if they want to reject him, then that’s there loss, a very big loss. So Sorry for all of you.
Why?
More productive than feeling sorrow would be to try to articulate an argument for why I am incorrect in anything I have written.
Of course, unless you can provide good reasons to believe in your god, that’s a meaningless comment.
You can tell children about your god in your churches. You cannot employ the power of the state to do your proselytization for you. If you try, you have to let everyone else in on an equal basis — Muslims, Wiccans, atheists…. everyone.
It’s arrogant to feel sorry for people for simply disagreeing with you.
It’s ‘a very big loss’ for children to NOT be taught about the bible? I guess the fundamental folks would not consider it a loss to not teach empirical evidence and science in the churches. Their prejudice and bigotry comes out loud and clear when you ask them to return the same that they ask of everyone else.
Naomi,
Should they also learn about Allah, Shiva, Baal and the Invisible Pink Unicorn?
“If you don’t like it, you can leave!”
If it’s not one thing it is another. I can’t imagine if all non-christians got up and left the commenter or any of his elk would be any happier. If it isn’t the atheists its the non-evangelicals or the catholics. I’m sure they wouldn’t be happy until it was just Fred Phelps and his merry band of idiots left.
I recently read that a persons god is a reflection of that person. I am not afraid of my god, s/he doesn’t need me to raise a Cross or post ten rules of behavior in public places. My god expects me to lead a moral, productive life of service to my family, neighbors and community. If I do that, when I die, my spirit will live on in the hearts of those I have influenced. Not an easy task, but one I spend my life living. Isn’t that what god wants for all of us? Forget “My God is better than your God”! “May all of you get what you deserve. Nothing more and nothing less”!
I believe that any religion that is willing to take the time to distribute their information to the children of any school should be allowed to do so. Maybe not during school hours and disrupting class, but before and after? Why not. I believe that as a Christian parent it is my responsibility to explain other religions and why WE believe what we do and why. If another religion where to give my child information, then that is just giving me an opportunity to teach my child more about our own religion.
And there are some children that would not EVER hear anything about any religion without this interaction. And as long as a child BELIEVES in something they are more likely to stay on a path that will enrich their lives and they will be guided by what THEY believe to a good life. I would rather my children believe in something, even if they didn’t agree with me, than to believe in nothing at all…
Why?
You can already do that. If you really want to explain to other religions, you would visit other houses of worship to distribute literature: mosques, synagogues, etc. Do you?
Is there a particular reason why you want to target other people’s children in a place where they are forced by law to attend??
So, you want to take advantage of the laws which require attendance in school in order to proselytize to other people’s children whom you might never have a chance to reach?
I believe that any religion that is willing to take the time to distribute their information to the children of any school should be allowed to do so.
Why? - Why not? If they truly believe enough that they are willing to take time out of their day to spread their beliefs, why not let them? It is not “hurting” anything by giving out their information. Seriously, what does it hurt? I would rather my children be well rounded individuals and know the other beliefs of the world than to live in a vacuum and think that our way is the only way. Because it is not and it never will be the only way.
I believe that as a Christian parent it is my responsibility to explain other religions and why WE believe what we do and why.
You can already do that. If you really want to explain to other religions, you would visit other houses of worship to distribute literature: mosques, synagogues, etc. Do you? - Actually - yes I do, to a degree. I have several friends that are of other religions (such as Mormon) and we love to discuss the differences and similarities of our religions. We also regularly discuss other religions at my churches bible study. How can you know you believe the right thing for yourself if you don’t know other beliefs as well? I talk with my 13 year old quite often about this.
Is there a particular reason why you want to target other people’s children in a place where they are forced by law to attend?? - I think schools are a place to learn - not only about acedemics, but also about the world in general - and religion is a large part of our world. If we want our children to grow up as well rounded adults don’t you think they should know how the world works and the differences they may face?
And there are some children that would not EVER hear anything about any religion without this interaction.
So, you want to take advantage of the laws which require attendance in school in order to proselytize to other people’s children whom you might never have a chance to reach? - Why is that taking advantage of anything? If a nurse is wanting to recruit for the nursing field, they are allowed to put out their information. That doesn’t mean that everyone that reads the information will become a nurse, but they get the information out there. I don’t see a difference in religion information. These individuals are not forcing anyone to convert to their religion, they are simply handing them their information.
Students are required to attend schools in order to learn, not in order to provide a captive audience for your proselytization. You need to provide good reasons for why you should be able to take advantage of this, not for why you shouldn’t.
You want to proselytize in schools and I asked if you do so at other houses of worship. The above is not a “yes” answer, it’s a no — no, you do not go to other houses of worship like you want to go to schools. Why not?
You only discuss religion with people who have already expressed an interest in doing so. So, why not do the same with kids — only discuss religion with those who approach you rather than approaching them while they are forced to attend school.
True, which is why classes on religion would be a good idea. Proselyitization from you is not the same as a class on history or math, so the fact that school is for learning is not a justification for allowing you to proselytize in public schools.
Because laws force kids to gather in large numbers in a central location — not for your proselytization, but for entirely different purposes. To try to proselytize to other people’s children when they haven’t given you explicit permission to do so is “taking advantage” of the situation.
Informing kids about career options is not the same as religious proselytization.