The mid-winter holiday season centered around Christmas may be a time of festivities for most people, but in America many other things intrude as well. Atheists must deal with questions about whether they will participate at all and if they should reveal their atheism. Conservative Christians proclaim that Christmas is meaningless without their religion and complain that both are being attacked by atheists. Should parents lie to encourage belief in Santa? How reliable are gospels stories about the Nativity?
Read Article: Atheists, the Christian Right, and Christmas Traditions
This is an interesting topic.
When I used to be a Xian, there were many, many symbolic taboos placed on the members. Where I attended, some members wouldn’t celebrate Xmas as a religious holiday because they considered it blasphemy:
1. It’s not condoned or endorsed in the Bible.
2. It’s pagan in origin.
Some other denominations don’t celebrate due to Biblical restrictions on sanctifying special days.
Some families wouldn’t celebrate at all–in any fashion, secular or religious.
One of the things I love about being an atheist is that I don’t have any group putting arbitrary taboos on me. Now, the “rules” make a lot more sense. If I don’t do X, it’s because I actually have a real-world reason for not doing X–or for why I consider X to be a bad idea. I have to reason it out.
As a Xian, it was wrong because I was told it was wrong–by church leaders, who interpreted a book–produced by church leaders.
So now, if I go to Japan, I can enter a Buddhist temple and engage in rituals. I can go to a Hindu temple and put flowers on an altar to Ganesha–because I think it’s a cool thing to do–not because I believe it–but because it’s fun to me to engage in a centuries’ old tradition in another land.
Likewise, I can go to hear a performance of Handel’s Messiah–and really enjoy it. Or I can watch Rudolph on TV and eat popcorn.
Shedding the bonds of the artificial penalty was a huge step forward for me. I never realized how really enslaved I was–in my mind. Superstitious thinking was putting a damper on my creativity and on my reason–both. “Fear is the mind-killer.” It’s so true.
I know that me, 25 years ago, would read this note and think how deluded this poor atheist is. How Xianity really “frees” you–and how Satan has a hold on my mind.
But that’s the taboo speaking–the superstitious fear. I don’t have to be afraid of the dark any longer. I don’t have to worry about the things I do that cause no harm to me or to anyone else. I don’t have to condemn actions I have no real reason to condemn–and to fear things I have no real reason to fear.
I respect anyone’s decision to celebrate or not–any holiday. For me, if I want to, I will. If I don’t, I won’t. I’m not compelled. Neither am I afraid.
Recently they had a reality show where they did something in a Buddhist temple. It was clearly expressed at the outset that it was _not_ a worship ceremony. One woman was Xian–and she totally freaked out. She couldn’t get comfortable, and said it felt too much like worship. She had to leave the temple finally–unable to get past her unreasonable fears. Unable to appreciate the beauty of the temple and of the ceremony. Unable to appreciate the history and reenactment of the ancient foreign traditions. She was so mentally oppressed. So frightened and stressed–just being there and participating.
And she was not the only person I’ve seen react that way in similar circumstances. For people like this–religion is poison. It has poisoned their minds. They see “demons” around every corner. It’s very sad.
Just recently, a coworker got a call to adopt a child–the sibling of another child she adopted about 2 years ago. She sits next to me, and while she discussed this decision with others on the phone or in the office–even with me, she kept saying things like, “I talked to Joan–and Joan thinks it’s a god-thing.” In context, just fyi, a “god thing” means: “God is telling me to do X.”
Here is a person getting ready to take on a MAJOR responsibility. A person who needs to account for all sorts of logistics here–day care, school, cost of living, and so on. And she’s trying to factor in whether or not little coincidences here and there are messages from the netherworld directing her to do X or Y.
Luckily, what I am actually seeing is that she wants the child. And she actually seems to be interpreting any excuse at a “god thing” to support her desire for the child. So, in this case, it’s not so much coincidences making her major life decisions as it appears to be her making her own decisions, and then justifying them via little coincidences (“I never threw that crib away–see, it’s a sign!”).
This is, I have to add, a VERY intelligent woman–who, if I’m to be honest, outflanks me in nearly ever aspect of our job duties. She’s a stellar worker and very bright and logical with her problem solving. But in personal matters…well?
Free the mind, and the rest will follow.
wow- that’s like the best comment I have ever read.
I agree with tracieh. As an atheist I live an odd life. My roommate is Muslim, his wife a “spiritualist.” Also, my best friend is Jewish and I come from a Christian family. Despite the fact that I am an atheist, I spend almost every Shabbat with my friend, I spend Christmas with my family, and even undertake various Muslim traditions. I personally find them all fascinating and find everything about religion fascinating.
All above said, I do get quit irritated with Christmas time. At work, my building has been playing Christmas music. This I don’t find odd, but it is insulting. It is insulting because all they play/sing are “Christian” songs, like “Joy to the World.” I guess all I want is to hear some Hanukah music or Kwanzaa music. I mean, how is it fair, not only to the atheist, but to everyone one else of every other religion that works in my building.
I like being considered the oddest atheist my friends new. I like the idea that I am known as one of the most tolerant atheists out there. However, instances like this just bring out the humbug and true hater atheist in me, not for the sake of atheism but for the sake of fairness to all who have chosen their own paths with or without faith.
You have all missed the point entirely. The holiday is a celebration of Jesus’ birthday, just like we do our own. To eliminate the holiday and its celebration would dictate that He never existed. Oh, but He does! Every atheist lives a lie, when it takes much more effort to deny that God exists, than to ask Him if He really is real, like I did at 17. Your are right in one thought… religion! God hates religion… remember those pharisees and saducees? Recall how Jesus rebuked them for being so religious? Well the point Jesus was driving at is… that we should come to Him just as we are, and enjoy a bonding RELATIONSHIP with Him. It’s not religion we are looking for. It’s relationship with our Maker.
Have a very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.
You have missed all the points entirely. How you celebrate Christmas is irrelevant to how others celebrate Christmas. There is no “one true way” to celebrate Christmas any more than there is “one true meaning” of Christmas.
1. Who is trying to eliminate Christmas?
2. It’s utterly absurd to say that eliminating Christmas would somehow “dictate” that Jesus never existed.
Prove it.
Maybe a conclusion you reached at 17 is worth reconsidering after becoming an adult.
Then why do you adhere to your own?
No, sorry, Please cite the chapter and verse where Jesus is ever described as rebuking anyone for being “religious.”
Sounds like a stalker.
Chad,
Your comment looks to my eyes like the things a Chad I work with at the MN Renaissance Festival would say. Would you happen to be my friend Chad from festival?
BTW! I happen to agree with you.
Lady Donna
Oh, twaddle. If Jesus was around today, he’d be beating you with a stick, and accusing you of ‘idolatry’. He was a Jew… and 1st century Jews didn’t celebrate birthdays. Birthday celebrations were a pagan custom. Jews… AND early christ-cult followers… thought that the practice was idolatrous. The nativity did not become a christian celebration until the MIDDLE OF THE 4TH CENTURY… to placate, bribe and seduce the pagans that they were trying to convert in the western parts of the empire, where they did not yet have the power to spread the christ-cult via torture, terror, murder and mobs of zealots, like they did in the east.
By the time that there even WAS a feast celebrating the nativity, the christ-cult had ALREADY been engaged in the persecution of pagans for decades… looting and destroying temples… burning libraries… killing pagans. A leader of monks responsible for the sacking of temples in Egypt famously told his victims “I removed your gods… there is no such thing as robbery for those who truly possess Christ.”
… and this stuff went on for ANOTHER 250 years.
Your ‘Christmas’ is NOT a “…a celebration of Jesus’ birthday.” It is the celebration of a cynical and opportunistic cultural hijacking.
The source of these recurring seasonal squabbles seems to be the fact that christians… most of them being abysmally ignorant of the content, origins and history of their own religion… think that they somehow own the ‘rights’ to what goes on during winter solstice celebrations, and thus get to dictate the behavior of people who are not similarly bamboozled.
When you think you’re talking to god… that’s “prayer.” When you think god’s talking to you… that’s “schizophrenia.”
Anyway… I don’t think anybody is asking that christmas be eliminated. I think that they’re just asking that you not impose it on people who are not so stupid and gullible that they would actually believe this christ-cult nonsense.
Do you believe in signs? Well… this is a sign that you are is stupid, gullible and pliable enough to submit your will… your reason… your conscience… your morality… to the control of a person… an organization… a dogma… a doctrine… that you trust (via ‘faith’) to convey a true expression of the ‘mind of god/Jesus’… even though… BY DEFINITION… NOBODY knows the ‘mind of god’.
Look… IF you ‘believe’ in god/Jesus, that is… BY DEFINITION… RELIGION. You can’t change that. NOBODY can change that… yet SOMEHOW, you have let yourself get bamboozled into thinking that it HAS been changed.
This religion vs. christianity ploy is a setup for a logical fallacy (a flaw in thinking): the “No True Scotsman Fallacy”…
When logical fallacies are used for the purpose of deceiving… that is called ‘sophistry’.
Disassociating ‘christianity’ from ‘religion’ is sophistry… the use of fallacy with the intent to deceive… an attempt to EVADE responsibility for evil, unforgivable deeds done.
I can see that you do not intend to deceive. No… you are merely a dupe who has been bamboozled, and been handed an argument that is intended to deceive… you go around trying to deceive others… and you don’t even know it.
Tracieh’s comment from over two years ago, is a fabulous answer. In my mind, these celebrations all reflect human culture. I even enjoy the religious Xmas carols this time of year… they are some of my favorite. I don’t think of them as celebrating anything religious. I think of them as great pieces of music. I can also enter into the gorgeous churches of Europe and appreciate them as manifestations of human ingenuity and artistry. I enjoy Giotto’s frescos and Michelangelo’s statues. I don’t need to believe in any divinity, any religion, any dogma to appreciate the beauty inherent in these works.
Religious people can celebrate this holiday however it suits them – they can make it about X’s birthday. I’m not telling them what to do. I think there’s a fair amount of projection when Xians post that atheists are “forcing” them to celebrate a certain way.
What an amazing nut house this Planet has been…and continues to be…?
After reading (7) DuckPhup’s, IMO, bullseye comment referencing Constantine’s, etc. “shtick”, an old personal, and fellow musicians’ lyric tinkering joke comes to mind; ala Mel Torme’s (who was Jewish) “The Christmas Song”:
“Chaste nuts roasting on an open fire…
Jack Frost nipping at your ______…
(your choice of private parts, of course…how ’bout…”crotch”?)”
[A variation, by the way of:
"Gentiles (etc.) roasting...yada, yada]
You get the picture.
I NEVER don’t agree with TracieH!
What a bunch of whiners.
Grow up. We live in a democratic country where the majority rules. Each of you will be dead long, long before people of faith are no longer in the majority. Might get use to Christmas and Easter. I don’t care if you celebrate an atheist holiday so why should you care if I do. Ohhh. That’s it, isn’t it? You guys do not have a holiday because what reasoning allows you to be happy, joyous and thankful.
Feel free to support this accusation… if you can.
I recommend a little research on the nature of a democracy. Just a hint, though: it isn’t simply about majority rules. You might have noticed a little thing called a “Constitution” which actually removes some subjects from simply majority votes.
It didn’t take that long for it to happen in Europe.
Actually, Christmas and Easter are as atheist as a person wants to make them. In case you hadn’t noticed, there’s nothing inherently Christian about trees, gifts, eggs, or rabbits. On the contrary, they are all pagan traditions which Christians stole because they didn’t have a holiday of their own. So don’t be a whiner when atheists appropriate the same days and traditions, mkay?
This athiest is happy, joyous, and thankful for lots of stuff EVERY day
“…there’s nothing inherently Christian about trees, gifts, eggs, or rabbits.”
Not to mention the etymology of the name, “Easter.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C4%92ostre
The majority never rules in a democratic country. The tyranny of the majority is one of the worst.
Daniel @ 11:
What a bunch of whiners.
I know exactly what you mean. Every year the Jeebus-heads start whingeing away about how those mean old atheists are ruining their holiday, blah blah blah, sob sob sob.
#4:
The holiday is a celebration of Jesus’ birthday
Well, except that there are no official records establishing that a person named Jesus was born on a date corresponding to December 25 of our current calendar. Biblical scholarship is not entirely decided on this matter either.
Wiki knows more than you do.
Not that facts, or the absence thereof, have ever prevented Christians from doing whatever their elders told them to do.
“Grow up. We live in a democratic country where the majority rules”
Where do you begin with such a statement? Ah, let’s try it with a simple test. Do you think the “Author” is:
a)African American
b)Homosexual
c)Woman
d)Unitarian
e)Hispanic
f)Made out of Red Crayon
g)Muslim
h)White, Male, Christian
i)Pagan
j)None of the Above
If you answered “H”, you are insightful, bright, well educated and of high intellect.
If you answered “yes” to any other, you are clearly a heathen.
“The Bill of Rights was created to defend the rights of the minority, even if the minority is a minority of one”.
Try to learn the QUESTION to that answer, Daniel, then maybe you can expand you’re understanding of all human rights, not just those that think their beliefs are rights, which they are not.
Happy New Year, to Everyone.
Let us have one thing straight. The U S A is NOT, and NEVER has been, a democratic country.
Before you start screaming, neither is any other country.
Democracy is where the people actually have input in the country’s governance. When did you (or myself) last have any input?
We have, arguably, democratic elections when we elect the next set of Corporate Masters or Dictators.
Even these elections when not manipulated by corrupt Judges or Politicians are, with the aid of unknown and mysterious financial backers, who direct by propaganda, and disinformation, the voters intentions into their desired areas, or the hands of compliant candidates. Failing this, then there is always the
disappearing ballot box. Er!!! That is if you still have a box where votes could be re-counted, and not some easily manipulated machine supplied by a cooperative and Party aligned company.
Ooohhh Tom! You old conspiracist, you!
Not that I much disgaree with you btw, especially as far as our home contry and its politicians are concerned.
Tom Edgar (19). I can only wish you were mistaken, but have to agree with you 100+%. Politics is of the Politicians, by the Politicians, and for the Politicians. The people’s input is taxes.
Maybe if they would play some music from Tool, The Who, or Zepplin once in a while, I might enjoy the holiday seasons a bit more. After all diversity is what makes life a bit more interesting and fair.
A few years ago I realized that the only winter date worth celebrating is Solstice, it being the only verifiable and measurable event, not to mention the ultimate turning point of Earth’s seasons.
That common theme throughout different cultures and religions concerning three days of death, then rebirth? Consider how the change of the tilt of the earth towards the sun is all but imperceptible on the day of Solstice and one day on either side.
Wow, some of these are great comments! I’m especially happy about those that express disagreement without bashing people over the head. More light and less heat are good things to have in any discussion of this sort.
It is well documented that Easter eggs, bunnies, the name of Easter, Christmas trees, Christmas decorations, the timing of Christmas, and the very celebration of Christmas really are not Christian in origin. Christians adapted these aspects of their religious holidays. But that doesn’t make any of it wrong. It just means that some (okay, most!) Christians use these symbols, names, and timing to enhance their worship. These practices simply not religious in nature and thus are open to everybody.
My opinion is unpopular, but I think the government shouldn’t officially celebrate Christmas by shutting down on Dec. 25. I don’t think that’d ever fly, because the non-religious Christmas celebrations are so ingrained in our popular culture.
The US was not actually founded on the idea of religious tolerance for everybody, just the idea that you could found a colony with your own brand of Christianity and celebrate it untrammeled. However, I think we’ve evolved to the point at which we should tolerate everybody’s beliefs. In my opinion, we’re in the process of figuring out how we will do that.
In the meantime, I go to church whenever I want to and celebrate the way I want to. I’m happy when others observe their religions or lack thereof in any peaceful manner. I respect the views of my observant Christian children and those of my atheist children.
And I get attacked by those who disagree with me on both sides. But that’s okay. I think it’s actually good for Christians to be challenged for their faith and even to suffer for it. That helps me to develop and act out my own faith. I don’t have to agree with any of you to think that you should be able to do the same.