When they were informed that religious rituals couldn't be made an official part of an official school function, they not only refused to do the ceremony completely but also decided to withdraw funds for college scholarships. So if they couldn't impose their religious beliefs on other people's children, they wanted to take their flag and their money and go home. What a great lesson to teach the students about morality, patriotism, and religion.
Poplar Bridge Elementary School Principal Gail Swor, who has led the school for 19 years, was one of those who called district officials concerned that prayers were part of last year's program.
As always, she said, students walked to the outdoor flagpole. Swor explained the significance of Veterans Day before turning the event over to the American Legion team, which included Selle.
"Last year was the first year that as part of the ceremony one of the gentlemen from the American Legion had all of us bow our heads in prayer," she said. "Frankly, it caught me off guard because they had never done that before. We do not do that in public school."
Swor said she told one of the veterans afterward that "he really could not do that ... in a public school setting. He was not happy, but he did not comment."
Source: Star Tribune (via: Greg Laden)
Principal Gail Swor says that prayers were never part of the ceremony until last year. The American Legion says that prayers were always part of the ceremony and that the decision to exclude them was new. One of them isn't telling the full truth here because their stories can't both be accurate. Even if the American Legion's version were true, however, that would at best give them a justifiable reason for surprise. It would not, however, justify ever having had the prayers before, continuing to have them in the future, or walking away like they did.
So even the most generous interpretation for the American Legion doesn't amount to much, and from there matters just get worse. The American Legion's position is basically that they should be permitted to impose their religious rituals on school children, contrary to the requirements of the Constitution, in exchange for a few thousand dollars in scholarship money. In a sense, it's almost like they are trying to buy into the school because they are financially punishing a few students when they don't get their way.
These attitudes are not limited to the American Legion, but can in fact be seen throughout the comments at the above article. Consider this form pmslater7:
When will we realize this nation was founded on biblical principals and our schools were started to train children in the truth about our history. Prayer was a big part of that history and should continue to be a choice in a "free" nation. We don't make "converts" by praying we just show respect to our God and to our veterns living and dead. There is nothing wrong with having someone bow there head for a moment of prayer, if they choose to join that's their business if they choose to plan what they're going to do after school that's their choice. You can't have a free nation and control every thought a person thinks. That's brainwashing and a dictatorship not freedom!
And this from curtainfalls:
I am a public school teacher. It is ridiculous that Bloomington would take such a position. Though there certainly were founders of this nation with a humanistic viewpoint, the majority held a strong belief in God. Separation of church and state has been misconstrued. It's original protections were protections of religion FROM the state. As a man who works with our young people each day, it is painfully obvious that many troubled youth and families would only be transformed by a relationship with God, one of the languages of which is prayer. I absolutely pray for the students and families I work with daily and hope that our nation comes to its senses.
The position expressed by pmslater7 was rejected by the courts long ago -- just because a student is free to not actively participate in a religious ritual like prayer doesn't mean that the government has the authority to incorporate such a ritual in an official school event. It doesn't matter if the ritual is being conducted by someone not employed by the school or the state. Individuals are free to pray on their own and while not acting in their official capacity, but that's it and that's how it should be.
>Prayer was a big part of that history and should continue to be a choice in a “free” nation.
“Freedom” to pray isn’t stiffled by not imposing prayer on others–by not putting students in the awkward position of forcing them to act a lie or out themselves as non-Christians (since most of these prayers are Christian in nature–and even the statement notes they want a prayer imposed as a “historically” significant religious ritual–which would make it clearly Christian and clearly discriminatory even toward other believers).
Meanwhile, statements like this totally blow my mind: “Though there certainly were founders of this nation with a humanistic viewpoint, the majority held a strong belief in God.”
Should we bring back slavery? Retract women’s right to vote? Repeal animal protection acts and national park lands? Stop using automobiles?
There’s a lot of crap our “founding fathers” either did or didn’t do that was hideous. The idea that just because it was good enough 200 years ago, it’s good enough today is just beyond belief.
how do you feel about praying for the death of our president?
http://www.westernrecorder.org/wr/wrsite.nsf/stories/200927-ImprecatoryPrayer
Ultimately, what we do today has far less to do with what earlier americans may or may not have done and ought to primarily focus on what we the living think, believe, value and hope for the future. Arguing that the founders of the United States did this thing or that thing is no argument for imposing the views of what is only one religion, one philosophy on a diverse population of students. Certainly, asking for a moment of silence seems appropriate to me for a memorial service for veterans living and dead, however, a moment of silence is respectful of all beliefs, a christian prayer is not.
The truth of the matter is this: not all americans and not all active duty military or veterans are christian or believers in monotheistic religions. It makes no sense to insult many of the people you are acting to honor.
Americans currently living today are far more relevant than those of the past. It is THEY who will decide what is or is not in the public interest and what is and is not respectful.
Personal prayer has never been an issue. I has never been threated. Prayer by hypocrites and fat heads is idolatry.
How about they invite the Catholic Veterans and have a Mass next year? There must be enough Muslim veterans by now to form an organization. Have them come over and read a few verses of the Koran. Or – if you want to keep it good and Protestant – bring the “God Hates Fags” people to explain how God is punishing America.